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EDITOR:
Another mass killing, and in an elementary school, no less. The shooting and the aftermath are beyond description. Down to a personal level, the pain each individual family feels at the loss of their child is where the rubber meets the road. This is the same feeling felt when any family member is lost — whether in a car accident, to a disease, or some other tragedy. It’s the same pain my friend felt when her 9-year-old son died of a brain tumor. It’s the same pain I felt when my good friend died from cancer at 38 in September. I cried like a baby. It hurt. Death hurts. And as much as hurts, we can’t seem to keep it from happening, no matter how angry we get.
Gun owners everywhere are bracing for the forthcoming outrage against guns and those who own them after the mass shooting in Connecticut. Gun owners hate these kinds of things as much as anyone else does. But did you know that every year 10 times the number of people killed with a gun in the U.S. die from alcohol related causes? Guns-1, alcohol-10. Yet alcohol remains perfectly legal and immune to public outrage. If you are truly outraged at the loss of life in Connecticut and you want to do something to stop senseless deaths, your time would be 10 times more effective in trying to ban alcohol than guns.
Maybe we should at least have a 10-day waiting period on alcohol purchases. And require a background check. If you’ve ever committed a felony, or have a history of alcoholism or mental illness in your family then you can’t buy alcohol. And you can only buy so much every month. After all, alcohol is 10 times more likely to kill someone than a firearm.
And these statistics about alcohol deaths are a fraction of the number of lives destroyed, but not ended by alcohol. Each year countless families are ripped apart, marriages are destroyed, children are devastated, and individuals are tormented by alcoholism. Alcohol is far, far more destructive than the 300 million responsibly owned and handled firearms. “That’s ridiculous — guns are for killing or maiming, alcohol isn’t.” Really? 99.999 percent of the 100 million legal gun owners in the U.S. acquired their guns with no intent of killing anyone and never will. Meanwhile, most of the people who buy alcohol buy it specifically to impair themselves, many to the point of the destruction of their own lives or the life of someone else.
Am I advocating the outlawing of booze? Nope. If you want to responsibly have a sip or even a gulp now and then or even every day, it’s simply not my business. It’s. Not. My. Business. And If I want to responsibly own a gun, it’s not yours.
If guns are truly the problem and outlawing them will solve this problem, then we also need to look at other, much more devastating problems in the U.S.; we need to shut down all fast food operations that serve food that when consumed irresponsibly could lead to obesity or heart disease. We also need to outlaw cars; four times more people die in auto accidents every year than by gun violence — that’s 400 percent more.
And how about cigarettes? For every person killed by gun violence in the U.S., 50 people die from smoking related causes — some of whom never even smoked. And then there are medical errors; for every gun related death, there are 19 deaths from medical errors. We must outlaw medical errors. (You can read these statistics for yourself at the CDC’s own Website: cdc.gov/nchs/deaths.htm.)
By the way, just over half of all homicides in the U.S. are perpetrated with a gun. We need to identify the means by which all the others were carried out and pass legislation to eliminate them. This would include knives, baseball bats, frying pans, anvils and ACME™ brand dynamite. In China, guns are strictly banned, yet murders still happen. In August this year, a man murdered eight people and injured five others — with a knife. That’s a mass murder. Without a gun. In March 2010, a man killed eight schoolchildren with a knife. In May 2010, another man killed seven schoolchildren and two adults with a meat cleaver. Similar crimes have been committed there with items such as box cutters, hammers and axes.
My point is this: We can’t mitigate all the dangers of a free society or of life in general. Bad things happen and they always will. Last month, a terrible accident happened and four people were killed on Highway 50 in Camino. What do we do to prevent this — outlaw deer on the highway? Prohibition of flatlanders on Highway 50? Ban Priuses? Minivans? Kids riding in cars? If kids were not allowed to ride in automobiles, the fatalities of that accident would have been reduced by half. After all, your child is four times more likely to die in an auto accident than from a gunshot wound.
After all the raw emotions settle down, we have to accept that in a free society (and even in a non-free society) bad things will happen. People will shoot, strangle, stab, drown, bludgeon, poison and _____ other people. Even if every means by which a murder can be carried out is banned. Murder is already against the law in any form. Passing more laws will not help. Restricting the freedoms of law-abiding gun owners will not help. Killers will kill and they will kill with whatever they can get their hands on. The worst school mass murder in U.S. history was not carried out with guns — it was with homemade bombs. Forty five people were killed of which 38 were children. Life can be very, very rough and has been since people were invented, and will always be, regardless of our efforts to legislate away the dangers thereof. There will always be evil and unstable people in every generation. They are the true problems, not the inanimate objects they use to perpetrate evil.
There’s more to be said, but until then remember, 100 million legal gun owners didn’t kill someone yesterday.
PATRICK D. MCATEE, SR
Camino
And the solution of having armed guards at schools that people are suggesting, even the NRA, is suggesting, is great, since schools are gun-free zones and need protection. So then the gun-free zone at a church needs guards after a shooting there, then the mall, then the whole UNITED STATES needs an armed guard. Or, just maybe you could get rid of all the guns??? Canadians watch the same tv. play the same video games, see the same movies, in many respects they are very similar to Americans except in gun deaths. A shooting spree is what happened in Newtown CN, Aurora CO, these two sprees alone almost account for the total gun death toll in Canada for the year. In a recent year, handguns killed 52 people in Canada and 10,728 people in United States of America.
The 2012 campaign and election will be seen as the beginning of the end of the Republican party. The December 2012 response to the Connecticut shooting will be seen as the door slamming shut on them. They have rallied around a culture of violence, blood and death. All sane people, even those with close held conservative beliefs, will not want anything more to do with these blood drenched psychos. They are finished. gone.
Yea colonel…maybe kinda like that money grubbing Obama and his followers that have sucked the life out of America. These folks that you mention do not represent all, just as you Obama lovers do not represent all.
You think the life has been sucked out of america? What a crappy little life you have. I weep for you.
Paddy O’furniture, on the matter of “fair and balanced” criticisms: I have no idea the political alignment of Dr. James Dodson, Franklin Graham or Bryan Fischer (I’ve never heard of the latter two). What does it matter? Have we become so politically sensitized, divided and BLIND that it now is necessary to do a sampling of all disagreeable positions before saying anything at all? I agree with you about Michael Moore, by the way. Constructive processing of a negative point of view does not require a YOUR SIDE IS WORSE response. Rather, is point of view valid or the information true?
Ms. Jueth, culture of violence, blood and death? I’m conservative minded and don’t have those thoughts unless you were to threaten any of my family and believe me I’m not going anywhere.
Evelyn, if you’ve never heard of the latter two then how in the world could you call them “vipers”? Someone once told me that “reality is complex”. Get real.
If James correctly represented what they said, then I’ll stick with VIPERS.
Sounds like your a cry baby ted. I’m embarassed for you.
Yes, you should be embarrassed. For any number of reasons.
Evelyn dear, just the mere fact that you said you’ve never heard of Franklin Graham tells me enough. Good evening.
DB Smith, I now have heard of them – LEADERS OF CHRISTIAN RIGHT RESPOND TO NEWTOWN MASSACRE, FAIL TO MENTION GUNS:
“Christian Right leaders continue to insist that the massacre at Sandy Hook Elementary School in Newtown, Connecticut, which took the lives of 26 people, including 20 six and seven-year-old children, happened because Americans have turned their backs on God. The list of prominent Religious Right leaders spewing this unholy venom now includes Dr. James Dobson, the founder and former head of Focus on the Family, Bryan Fischer, a popular American Family Association talk-show host, and Franklin Graham, the president and CEO of the tax-exempt Billy Graham Evangelistic Association.” ********** http://tinyurl.com/ctp6d68
DB Smith, there’s an amazing amount of stuff and number of people I don’t know about. Upon your return please provide me with a primer of essential knowledge so that I may avoid future embarrassment.
Ahhhhh . . . Franklin Graham is BILLY’S son. How could I not have known? Now I understand why DB Smith fled the scene!
Evelyn, during your childhood do you remember something called the 10 Commandments. One of those commandments says “Thou shalt not murder/kill.” If somebody is doing the opposite of that then from a religious perspective would you say they are turning their backs on God?
Evelyn, the only reason I’m going to flee the scene is because at this very moment I am smelling something very good coming from the kitchen.
DB: You’re back! Does that mean we’re still speaking? Yes, I do remember the 6th Commandment. I’m a big fan of it, and consider murder, assassination & torture immoral — definitely not life affirming.
And, finally . . . Lost in all the toing and froing was that my initial response to Jame’s 1:36 pm comment was unrelated to perception about alignment of Messrs Dobson, Graham & Fischer. More important is the WHAT, not the WHO.
Mr. O’furniture, Michael Moore is wrong because not all gun owners are racists, nor are all racists gun owners. But his stupid statement does not raise to the level of religious shysters saying that God directed the killing of 20 little children because Americans have turned their back on him. See fair and balanced: Moore is stupid making such a statement (if did), and the two religious leaders and talk show host are beneath contempt. And, they would really like some donations from their base to help their work in saving America.
ADDED: And, like Mr. Smith, I also smell something good coming from the kitchen so will be back
later.
Hi Catherine! Yes, my last paragraph stating that signs saying, “Gun free zone” should be replaced by signs saying, “We carry machine guns,” was humour (British spelling.) Hopefully everyone knows that crazy people do not heed signs. And that is one reason why they should be locked up.
I don’t say much because of the really irritating reCaptha thing that one has to fill in. I don’t get it right half the time, so I must be half of an autobot. Some of them are indecipherable.
Evelyn and Darrin, it’s probably a mistake to quote statistics as a means to understand this mess. Out of 32, Switzerland is actually tied for third in gun related homicides per 100,000 population in industrialized countries. Canada is tied with Ireland for 8th. Agreed that USA is ranked 1st by a long shot. At 89 guns for every 100 civilian population in the USA, it is tempting to make an inference. But as every budding statistician learns about the inference between rates of rape and sales of ice cream, these issues are never quite so easy to understand. Let alone solve.
More on stats: In 2011 Great Britain reported 6 guns for every 100 civilians and 41 gun-related homicides. Finland reported 45 guns per 100 civilians and 24 gun homicides. So one would be tempted to think the number of guns doesn’t correlate. But the rate in Finland is 0.45 per 100,000 population vs.
0.07 per 100,000 population in Great Britain.
J Otherside: I couldn’t agree with you more about the problem of using statistics to prove causation. It’s almost certain that the issue of gun violence (for instance) is much more complex than simply the number of guns in circulation.
billzz, about CAPTCHA: It used to drive me crazy. As you say, some of them are indecipherable. It was ages before I noticed the way through this. Have a look at the box at the bottom that says “Type the two words”. IMMEDIATELY to the right is a symbol with 2 circling arrows = “Get a new challenge”. So …. when presented with the indecipherable, press that symbol and you’ll be given two new words. That can be repeated as many times as necessary. (You won’t lose your already-typed comment.)
A change of subject: The chained CPI seems to have found its time — it has been bouncing around the Belt Way for many years. It won’t make a wit to me as I’m not living on the edge, but I don’t think it’s good for those oldsters living on the edge where every dollar makes a difference (especially given the current CPI and especially the chained CPI which have little relationship to the real cost of living increase each year). It’s estimated that the chained CPI will save $12 billion each year, and it’s taken out of the hide of the poor. Want to save some money? How about a modest speculation tax. Just 1/4th of a cent for each transaction. It would gain $350 billion a year and which of us, rich or middle class, would mind a 1/4 of a cent transaction tax? Twelve billion versus 350 billion — why is this so hard for our bought Congress? Oh, that’s right because they are bought.
Today has been exhausting. First I had to find out who this Franklin Graham is. Now James is back from dinner talking about “chained CPI”. I need to look it up before DB Smith returns. That will save him the trouble of including in that primer he’s working on for me! Or, since I’m in lazy mode, perhaps James would be so good as to explain it: IN SIMPLE LANGUAGE. (Not kidding, I really don’t know what it is.)
Evelyn, it’s a new way to gauge the yearly increase in the cost of living index. The premise is that if beef is too expensive, you will buy chicken, or if you are living on the line cat food. Hence the cat food CPI indes.
The difference between today’s method of gauging CPI and the chained CPI is about a .3 reduction.
So, if your social security check is $1,000 and the CPI is 3%, instead of getting $1,030 you would get $1,027. Only three dollars, but it escalates each year and over time your benefit is cut at higher levels. Now, $3 is virtually nothing, but if you are one of the poor oldsters living on the line it has meaning. And, why take it out of their hide when a transaction tax would make $238 billion more?
Thanks, James, for the “chained CPI” explanation — and for making it simple enough for me to understand! Several years ago I had heard about the method, but it wasn’t attached to a name. Hamburger instead of steak, cat food instead of chicken. At the time I thought “what a fraud”. Now, my thoughts are unprintable.
Gun control is a joke. Bad guys do not obey the laws…duh. The columbin shooters stole the guns. Intereting how the government can afford to put a psychologist on an elementry campus, but not a cop or a guard? All of our miliatary get trained in the use of a weapon, why not a teacher or two?
By the way, did you notice that the leftist media failed to tell you all that the shopping center attack a few weeks ago in Portland, Oregon was stopped by a 22 year old resident with a concealed weapon permit?
The only thing that can stop a bad guy with a gun is a good guy with a gun.
Only after his AR-15 repeatedly jammed and he committed suicide. The only place I’ve heard you version was on fox news.
Bushmasters popped up at the following mass shootings: Last week’s Oregon mall shooting, Aurora/Holmes, similar as Bushmaster used in Beltway Sniper Mohamed/Malvo.
Bushmasters are popping up like mushrooms after a hard rain in mass shootings and they happen to just coincidentally be the exact type of weapons feds want to ban.
Yes, Richard, when he was trying to clear/reload his rifle, he saw a man pointing a gun at him, so he gave up trying to clear the rifle, pulled his handgun, stopped shooting victims and shot himself instead. You found this website, try a little internet research. You will find the story well covered in Portland, including an interview of the man himself. Fact-good guy with a gun pointed at the dirt bag=no more victims. And no, I did not see it on Fox, I first heard it on the John McGinnis show on kcra.
For those not experienced with dirt bags, maybe we listed to the advice of those who are, instead of the politicians who take money from one side or the other.
O’furniture, you are just a jackass… If for no other reason that you are one.
J. Otherside, I agree, it is a bit late, but do we sit idly by and let more people die and call each other names like Paddy O, no, I think not. It is time for action. Make the penalties for not locking your guns up and making them accessible higher. Here is a good article about guns in Canada. “Public safety’s better served by knowing where all the firearms are and making people accountable for the ownership of their firearms,” he said.
http://www.wbez.org/story/under-gun-burden-being-gun-owner-canada-90096
the guy in portland ran into a stairwell to unjam his weapon after he saw the other guy pointing his gun. then he committed suicide. the rightwing alternate universe has run with this story always infering that the shooter was “stopped” ie, killed by the guy claiming to have pulled his gun.
Makes a good story Bill. “As he was about to fire, Meli said he noticed movement behind the shooter. Meli was afraid if he misses, another innocent person would be hurt. Meli says the shooter saw him and his gun and seconds later took his own life.”
I was in Portland yesterday with a former cop buddy. His comment was, ” Meli had nothing to do with the out come as things played out and was lucky he wasn’t shot by Portland PD.”
It’s kind of interesting; thanks to the whores in the drive-by media, we know the intimate details of each of the shootings-Aurora, Tucson, Sandy Hook-including the shooter, the guns used, some of the victims names and stories, etc. The shooter is immortalized and even glorified and we know everything about them. And then we get jackasses like Richard and Darrin who call for more gun control and say things like more guns won’t help. But who can off the top of their head tell us anything about the Colorado Springs Church shooting in 2007? Anybody know the shooter’s name? How many he killed? How he was stopped? No. We don’t want to. Because the shooter, armed with a rifle and two handguns and lots of ammo, was shot dead by a woman carrying a concealed pistol. Why doesn’t this get mentioned? Oh, that’s right, because it’s an unfavorable scenario for gun control nuts. Same beginning as every other mass shooting, but this woman prevented it from being bigger than Columbine. How? With another gun. And no one talks about it. Can you say “hippo-crit”?
Paddy O’Jackass has ONE incident where a gun toting shooter killed a someone and thinks that is the reason to arm the rest of the US, genius, O’Jack! Where were all the other saviors for the mass shootings?
Geez, Richard, what do you think stops these guys? The no guns sticker on the window? The CT killer gave up when the cops (with guns) showed up, just like almost every other one.
Tell you what, you move to New York City if you feel safer there.
When a state changes to right to carry, violent crime goes down.
Those who buy into the ridiculous NRA notion that more guns will buy safety, are drenched in the blood of innocent children.
No sid, nobody wants more guns. We want the good guys to have the right to protect ourselves from the bad guys. A gun is the tool used to protect ourselves. It is one hell of an effective deterrent.
Vigilantes are more trouble than there worth to law enforcement. I don’t have the answer but limiting weapons with more than ten round capacity and annual license fees for all weapons is a good place to start. The revenues could good to law enforcement and mental health services.
Sadly, at a little under one legal firearm for every civilian man, woman, and child in the US (0.89 to be exact) arguments about the number of guns are specious at best. The cat is already out of the bag as the guns are out there right now. To put the cat back in would take massed armed force to physically remove firearms from circulation, the only way to ensure that not just law abiding citizens turn them in. Not going to happen. The only argument worth refining is how, when, and what firearms can be legally deployed by civilians. As the evil/unstable among us change tactics that deployment needs to change as well until better methods of dealing with their ilk are developed and utilized successfully.
It has been said many times before, it’s being said now, and it’s plain reality; there hundreds of millions of guns in the hands of private US citizens today and this will never change. To wish or hope for otherwise is pi$$ing in the wind. Maybe when some of you’s that hope for gun control sit on MallSanta’s lap next year, you should ask him to make all guns disappear. Would have the same result. The neat little utopia that your Peace Prize President has promised you aint happening.
Back in your hole fruit cake.
The man in the Colorado church in 2007 was not killed by the ex-police officer, although she did hit him. He shot himself.
@James E – It is interesting to read the comment you posted about “James Dodson, Franklin Graham, and Bryan Fischer claim the massacre of 20 tiny children happened because Americans have turned their backs on God.” If the lack of religion in the US was truly to blame, then why are’t European countries experiencing even MORE murders and death since they lead the US in the decline of church attendees and believing in god, unicorns and magic underpants.
Darrin, don’t ask ridiculously logical questions. We all know death by magic underpants is rare.
Evelyn, Sorry. I believe!
For the – Schools Need Armed Guards – crowd, here are some more ideas.
Firemen need armed guards.
Search the SacBee for – NY firemen’s killer mapped out plan for slayings
Mall Cops need armed guards.
Oh, wait, this guy didn’t kill anyone, but some armed citizen should have shot him or a bystander anyway. Then they could get shot by the police who respond because they are shooting people… Where does it end?
Search the SacBee for – Man cooperative after firing shots at mall
Drivers need armed guards.
Search the SacBee for – Driver killed in East Los Angeles shooting
or
Man fires at couple in SUV, passenger wounded
The Police need armed guards – Wait, police already have guns.
Search the SacBee for – Kansas man who killed 2 cops dies
Homeowners need armed guards – Robber shoots resident with own rifle
Search the SacBee for – Robber shoots resident with own rifle
Whoops, maybe MORE GUNS are not the ANSWER!!!