Friday, April 18, 2014
PLACERVILLE, CALIFORNIA
99 CENTS

D’Agostini’s meeting

EDITOR:

Mr. Garon criticized the Sheriff’s letter to Vice President Joe Biden on gun control and he made some senseless comment on the Sheriff’s refusal to accept the social scientists as experts in the field. Approximately 19 law enforcement agencies wrote to the V.P. and most were from Northern California. There were over 500 law enforcement agencies nationwide that wrote to the V.P., so Mr. G., are all those agencies just typical gun-lovin’, gun-totin’ cops who belong to the Tea Party?

Gee, I wish I were as smart as you think you are. Professor Larry Beutler, spokesperson for the Democratic women’s organization, Ph.D. in Psychology of Terrorism, announced that he was not going to be as brief as the Sheriff was in has initial remarks. So be it — but how about accuracy? First he calls us a violent country — tell me Mr. G., how many beheadings have you seen here, how many hands cut off, how many women have you seen buried in the ground up to their heads and stoned to death? And how about social injustices? Seen any of our women denied the right to drive an auto; do they have to cover themselves from head to toe so no can see them?

So who are you comparing us to? His statement that the FBI says we have 100,000 gun-related deaths every year. I think he misquoted — or something was left out by the reporter. The figure 100,000 is generally used to represent a population count of state, county, city, etc. to come up with a percentage figure such as homicide rates per 100,000 population. And Beutlers rhetorical question — does reducing the access to guns reduce firearm violence? He further states: We have an empirical marker showing that people who own guns are more likely to die by guns! He said in praise of good science and good research, the scientific method allows us to take the emotion out of the issue.

Well, not truly knowing the meaning of empirical, I decided to see what Mr. Webster says about it. And guess what I found? Empiric: A person who is ignorant of scientific principles and relies solely on practical experience. Hmmm.

So, if you used scientific status to come to your conclusion, did you relate that to the audience and/or did the reporter just fail to jot them down? Just curious.

The professor also stated that studies concluded that guns are much more likely to be used to intimidate and threaten than to protect home and self. What studies led you to this conclusion? Just curious. And your statement that about 200 cases of non-police officers saving their own lives with a gun … professor, you haven’t done your homework — many studies from anti-gun groups and pro-gun groups have come up with figures from as low as 65,000 per year to 2.5 million per year, not the 200 per year you have cited. Where did you get this from? Just curious.

One last thing, professor. The American Medical Association (and I assume you mention this group for a point of authenticity) … in 2009 there were 941,304 doctors in the USA. Doctors that belong to the American Medical Association in 2009 were 63,000. This means that 898,304 do not belong to the AMA. And another scientific group — again I suppose you mention them for a point of authenticity — the American Psychological Association … their Website shows nothing on gun violence in the USA. It won’t even tell me how many members they have. You apparently have to be a member to find out. And your “various other scientific groups” I could not look at since you didn’t mention them by name. Just curious.

And Professor Beutler, where are your statistics on “most murders are committed not by criminals but as crimes of passion?” Somehow this statement does not make a whole lot of sense.

P.S. Welcome back Larry Weitzman. I’m looking forward to your great, sensible writing ability.

HERMAN WILMOTH
Shingle Springs

Letters to the Editor

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Discussion | 48 comments

  • francescaduchamp@att.netMay 20, 2013 - 11:33 am

    Up here groups are saying that we have become a violent place--I dont get it. There are few here...law enforcement does a good job of coming quickly to neighbors calls--I have only called once in the 14 yrs I have lived on this street. People are frightening people...different world.

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  • francescaduchamp@att.netMay 20, 2013 - 11:34 am

    a few violent acts--usually yelling (sorry left out of other post)

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  • cookie65May 27, 2013 - 4:44 am

    How old is this letter? It isn't difficult to know when anyone on the left is struggling with honesty and truth. Their lips are moving. According to the LATimes gun crime has plunged but most Americans believe the opposite. You have to remember a few things about the left and their dynamic logic. Food insecurity causes childhood obesity, global warming causes record snow fall, you can improve the life of those who won't work by punishing those who do, disarming law abiding citizens will make them safer, the problems caused by too much government can be solved with even more government, the IRS wasn't targeting organizations opposed to the leftist takeover of America and obamacare will lower your healthcare costs.

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  • cookie65May 27, 2013 - 4:46 am

    Here is the LATimes from May 7 of this year exposing the misinformation the left depends on to further restrict freedom and liberty. http://www.latimes.com/news/nation/nationnow/la-na-nn-gun-crimes-pew-report-20130507,0,3022693.story

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  • Dink LaneMay 27, 2013 - 1:52 pm

    Among the 19 law enforcement agencies who signed the letter to the VP was White-Supremacist (photos) "Sheriff Joe Arpaio of Maricopa County"..... who can't read a "black Man's" birth certificate (Sees no problem with McCain's Panama City birth certificate).... Can't find a rapist (over 400 cases in 2010 Report NOT investigated) but CAN find a U.S. Citizen with Latino heritage and have him deported to Mexico (in the same 2010 report)..... I'm GLAD D'Agostini is NOT like that.... but some of those "Law-Enforcement" signatures (which includes Isleton's Sheriff, Hummmm) ...... Think about it.... over 40,000 law enforcement agencies WANT responsible gun ownership.... 40,000 19 (Not quite equal) ...... I think it's time to think Solutions instead.

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  • NancyMay 28, 2013 - 4:32 am

    Thank you, Sheriff John, for writing the letter to Joe Biden. I support you 100%. El Dorado County has the best law enforcement staff in California, in my opinion.

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  • cookie65May 28, 2013 - 5:30 am

    I made the statement that you can tell when someone on the left is struggling with the honesty and truth when their lips are moving and sure enough dink comes along and provides the evidence. He claims there are over 40,000 law enforcement agencies that WANT responsible gun ownership. Well according to the Bureau of Justice Statistics there are only 18,000 law enforcement agencies. He must get his "facts" from the same place as larry beutler. http://www.bjs.gov/index.cfm?ty=tp&tid=71

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  • cookie65May 28, 2013 - 8:18 am

    dink’s call for responsible gun ownership is as shallow and transparent as obama’s focus on jobs. It is nothing more than leftist speak for government infringement on the 2nd Amendment. Responsible gun owners are not and never have been a threat to anyone other than tyrannical government. When some hoddy in north sac stands in someone’s front yard and opens fire on their house killing a 10 year old girl it isn’t a responsible gun owner. It is a thug element of society that didn’t go thru a universal background check and a 10 day waiting period to get the gun they used. It is estimated that as many as 55 million households in America own 300 million non-military guns. Those are the responsible gun owners. How can we tell? Because their guns aren’t committing any crimes. In the warped and twisted leftist mentality there is no such thing as responsible gun ownership. The one-way diode circuits within their brains view gun ownership as a threat to society. Never mind the religion of peace butchering people with meat cleavers and pressure pots. There is nothing that comes from the left that can be taken at face value since their entire belief system is based on lies. dink can’t even resist making it about racism in his pre-established loonatic ravings. The only racism involved in gun violence is the minority on minority murder rate. None of them are responsible gun owners.

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  • Dink LaneMay 28, 2013 - 10:57 am

    Let's just use Cookies' facts for sake of argument... OK, 19 vs. 18,000...... 18,000 vs. 19 ..... Hum..... Looks like the argument still stands ... and Cookie and Nancy stand with Law Enforcement officers like Sheriff Arpaio.... who throws the Constitution out the window....

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  • HEADS UP!!!!!May 28, 2013 - 11:13 am

    Words out that Supervisor Ray Nutting has been indicted by a criminal Grand Jury. GOB's going down!

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  • NancyMay 28, 2013 - 11:35 am

    Dink, it is Obama and the Left whom have thrown the Constitution out the window. Incidents like Benghazi, the DOJ spying on reporters, the IRS targeting Conservatives and religious leaders/groups like the Tea Party and Billy Graham and using drones against Americans proves that. Now the DHS is stock piling huge amounts of ammo. What do think those rounds are planned to be used for? Wild turkey shooting? YOU too can become a victim of government tyranny just like others I've mentioned already have. Gun control/confiscation will certainly expedite that to happen. Nobody is immune to the abuses of an out of control government like this one. What makes you even more of an easy target is that you have your head in the sand. Wake up and smell the coffee.

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  • cookie65May 28, 2013 - 11:46 am

    dink, you said there were 40,000 law enforcement agencies that support responsible gun ownership. I pointed out that there aren't 40,000 law enforcement agencies, only 18,000. Where do you get the idea that 18,000 law enforcement agencies have anything at all in common with the anti-2nd Amendment leftists? There are hundreds of Sheriff departments all across America who support the 2nd Amendment as written and even more that haven't stated any support for the lefts agenda. The left lies about everything under the sun and when you call them on it they just reconfigure the lie.

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  • cookie65May 28, 2013 - 11:51 am

    An obamazombie like dink accusing others of throwing the Constitution out the window. Now that is rich. Hey dink, any idea how many drugs get smuggled into the United States thru Arizona? I guess you think that is a good thing.

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  • James E.May 28, 2013 - 12:01 pm

    If Mr. Nutting has been indicted by a criminal Grand Jury, this must be front page news. Will this be the first member of the BOS ever indicted in El Dorado County?

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  • James E.May 28, 2013 - 12:17 pm

    Nancy, I wonder if the Benghazi, DOJ wiretap/records, and IRS scandals aren't petering out? Benghazi reduced to who played with the talking points; DOJ wiretap/records authorized under the Patriot Act; and IRS investigation will look into whether the Tea Party got undue attention and a review of all applicants approved to see who lied to the IRS about political activities.

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  • Kirk W MacKenzieMay 28, 2013 - 12:22 pm

    James -- back in the mid-80s a supervisor was prosecuted and convicted of growing pot.

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  • Ken SteersMay 28, 2013 - 1:04 pm

    James you are absolutely right if you are Left. Did any Americans die in Benghazi? James the answer is no. Recent memory Ray's predecessor Bauman was arrested for DUI. I remember Charlie Payne, a Supervisor, was booted for moving to Costa Rica and still wanted his seat. Joe Harn refused to mail his check over seas. '88 Mike Visman got 2 1/2 years Fed. for growing pot. It seems to happen every 10 years or so.

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  • francescaduchamp@att.netMay 28, 2013 - 1:58 pm

    heads up--substantiate your remark please

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  • Ken SteersMay 28, 2013 - 3:05 pm

    Francesca, Ray is in jail...

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  • francescaduchamp@att.netMay 28, 2013 - 3:22 pm

    ken --I saw...thanks. i like Ray--one has to know that my space is small--we all know of each other. although he has been arrested--I hope this will lead to the others also going under a investigation. Seem s to me--that some in government have been accused of harsher things. I still believe that people are innocent until proven guilty--shaking head--I know i am very trusting.

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  • francescaduchamp@att.netMay 28, 2013 - 3:28 pm

    As I have said before--these grants and "free" money will come for a stiff price. I hope this county wakes up--before it is too late. I will stand by one of my own...some "good" people back him up here...we will have to wait and see.

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  • Ken SteersMay 28, 2013 - 3:53 pm

    Francesca, there is no such thing as free money. I feel bad also.

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  • francescaduchamp@att.netMay 28, 2013 - 4:02 pm

    no--no "free" money...but people are acting like grant money is "free." Well interesting development--again I hope they look at the whole board for a variety of issues. I am very low on the ladder--so I just know all these people as faces at town fund raisers. Most are very polite to me. His wife and young son must be hurting...

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  • observerMay 28, 2013 - 4:11 pm

    Big tears from Ken who is so disappointed and so are Jack and Dallas and Angelo.

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  • francescaduchamp@att.netMay 28, 2013 - 4:24 pm

    Well Im off for awhile--but food for thought--what is the worst thing you have seen done in this county recently by any of the supervisors--Ray still feels like the sacrifice. For me its signing on the New Economy...but that plan hasnt even begun to show its teeth...it has been here for awhile...pfft Grant money.

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  • Ken SteersMay 28, 2013 - 5:21 pm

    Francesca, his boys were cross town rivals to mine. UM/Pondo. We have had many a long conversation, running late into the night discussing the art of turning young boys into young men. Observer, are you implying that I have some sort of allegiance to the Sweeney's or Tsakopoulos? I'm not a developer. And I'm quite concerned about the project planned to go next to where I live. I do very much like the Sweeney's, and have worked closely with Dallas and Trish helping kids so?...

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  • James E.May 28, 2013 - 5:29 pm

    Ken, you ask if four Americans were killed at Benghazi. Yes. And, between January 22, 2002, and September 17, 2008, 93 Americans were killed by attacks on our embassies and consulates, one being U.S. Diplomat David Foy.

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  • James E.May 28, 2013 - 5:32 pm

    Assume Mr. Nutting will be bailed out by tomorrow afternoon.

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  • Ken SteersMay 28, 2013 - 6:35 pm

    Yes James, and how many were abandoned with no support. It took 5 1/2 hours for our President to take his first action in which to call Hillary in which those two decided to blame a video that no one seen. 9 hrs later the last two Seals were taken. I know for a fact sir that you would have rescued those poor soles. Or died trying.

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  • cookie65May 28, 2013 - 7:39 pm

    The Truth is like a pocket of air at the bottom of a lake. Nothing can keep it from surfacing at some point. Whatever it may be.

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  • NancyMay 28, 2013 - 7:41 pm

    Oh my gosh. It is true. Ray Nutting has been arrested on 4 felony counts. Wow!!!!

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  • DB SmithMay 28, 2013 - 7:54 pm

    Colonel, According to Wikipedia...during Clinton's 8 year presidency there were 224 embassy related deaths. The count on Bush's 8 year presidency was 60 embassy related deaths. Obama now has 13 embassy related deaths in his first 4 years. I don't know where you got your figures from but it's really not about the numbers is it? We should all be more interested in the FACTS of how they became a number. It all looks really stinky and I think we'll find out very soon. Don't you really want to know the truth?

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  • cookie65May 28, 2013 - 8:11 pm

    Remember when obama joked about lipstick on a pig and his Jamestown gathering cheered and jeered? He found it. http://www.kcra.com/news/politics/Lipstick-on-his-collar-Obama-explains/-/11797268/20334350/-/9rwfx6/-/index.html

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  • francescaduchamp@att.netMay 28, 2013 - 8:51 pm

    Ken...Ray has done many nice things for our community--I just came from baseball--he has many supporters there as well--small space up here...we know him and his family from all the fund raisers they attend to help our ever growing needs in Pollock. My thoughts will be with his family tonight.

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  • Kirk W MacKenzieMay 28, 2013 - 9:14 pm

    If Democrats controlled both the House and the Senate, would we even know about Benghazi, the IRS, etc? Probably not. That makes me wonder how many scandals during the Bush administration that got swept under the rug because Republicans did control both the House and Senate. One more reason to vote for divided government.

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  • NancyMay 28, 2013 - 9:21 pm

    This is very hard to believe about Ray. I don't know much about the law but how is what he is accused of are felonies? But that is what the news is saying.http://www.tahoedailytribune.com/news/6702175-113/nutting-county-dorado-according

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  • James E.May 28, 2013 - 10:35 pm

    Ken, a military response to Benghazi -- where am I located? At the Embassy at Tripoli, or in Italy, or 20 miles outside Benghazi? Do I have an Air Cavalry unit with gun ships and Infantry in Libya within striking distance? Will I have fuel/ammo capability in or near Benghazi? What is the enemy situation? A mob firing mortars into the compound? Air cover not available due to distance? The Chairman of the Joint Chiefs has said that military force was not close enough to influence the outcome. But, seems I've read there was a small force (20? men) in Tripoli that were denied coming to the aid of the Consulate? But where were they specifically? How were they going to get to the Consulate? Given it was a mortar attack, would 20 men have made a difference since they would have been unsure of the location of the mortars and probably would have been decimated by mortar fire? Maybe they were denied because it would have been not 4, but 24 lost. So many factors to consider. Any commander would rush to respond if it was possible. But, it's simply not the movies where the Rock and Bruce Willis parachute in and save the four. The real world and the movies are different.

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  • Ken SteersMay 28, 2013 - 10:50 pm

    James, No hypotheticals. 2 men drove from Tripoli to help fellow Americans in Benghazi. If they hadn't had taken matters in their own hands, by what people who were there have stated. Many more American's would have died. No movie. No B.S. During your career, you ignored your own safety to rescue comrades under direct fire. With hypotheticals. Give you an Apache AH-64. There wouldn't have been anything left of those motherless devils than hair teeth and eyes all over the walls. A whole lot is missing to the story.

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  • James E.May 29, 2013 - 12:48 am

    Ken, true, but there was no AH-64s. Two men drove from Tripoli and saved the day? How exactly? Yes, seven times I rescued my guys, but I was on station with proper equipment and support. I couldn't have done it if they were 50 miles away. I know how desperate you are to have something for impeachment, but this isn't it. Red meat for the base, but that's it.

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  • James E.May 29, 2013 - 11:40 am

    Just for general knowledge: Distance from Tripoli to Benghazi is 405 miles and driving time is 13 hours.

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  • DB SmithMay 29, 2013 - 12:09 pm

    Colonel, you're a glutton for punishment. What do you think would have happened if Obama or Hildabeast were in Benghazi that night. Do you think it would have been too far to go? I hope you get my point sir.

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  • James E.May 29, 2013 - 12:37 pm

    DB, I would have said what in the heck was the President and the SecState doing in Benghazi without protection? Well, of course they wouldn't be, but the premise of your comment indicates they were. So, if they were, they would have been lost and we would have a new president (Biden) and a new SecState. Moral of the story: Ambassadors should stay in the embassy where they are protected by Marines. The Ambassador was put into the country by ship via CIA, and worked with the rebels. He therefore felt he was safe to travel around the country without a Marine battalion escort (Infantry and mortars with counter-battery fire). A fatal mistake on his part. Went into Marlboro country without protection -- not a good thing to do if you want to collect Social Security.

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  • James E.May 29, 2013 - 1:02 pm

    ADDED: Of course it would not be practical for a Marine Battalion to follow an Ambassador while he travels around a country -- that's why Ambassadors normally stay in the Embassy, where they are surrounded by Marines. Regarding my earlier comment about Ms. Bachmann, the mention of her not getting reelected or being investigated were not my thoughts -- they were her thoughts, as she put them in her TV announcement of not running again.

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  • James E.May 29, 2013 - 1:08 pm

    Slight change of topic allowing the Nutting "scandal" to simmer on the stove for a bit. Eric Cantor, House Majority Leader has said President Obama has lost his focus and is disconnected. Representative Cantor, is that all you have? Really?

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  • Kirk W MacKenzieMay 29, 2013 - 1:48 pm

    Only 405 miles? Chuck Norris could cover that in a single commercial break...

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  • EvelynMay 30, 2013 - 1:49 pm

    "California Senate approves 8 gun control bills, including ammo registry" - HERE

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  • EvelynMay 30, 2013 - 2:08 pm

    Here's one that might please both "liberals" AND "conservatives", though for each very different reasons. (You'll have to skip to the last paragraph to know why.)

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  • EvelynJune 28, 2013 - 2:08 pm

    "Woops! Obama Ordered Gun Report Reveals Guns Actually Save Lives" - HERE

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