Comments on: Responsible Growth requires a plan

By: Foamie Mouth®

Foamie Mouth® — Wed, 13 Feb 2013 06:03:01 +0000

Old Joe you know old pope bennie’s quittin end of the month. With your bent for neelin and heelin we’re puttin in a good word for you. When white smoke rises we’ll be shoutin that name: JOE, JOE, JOE.

By: Old Joe

Old Joe — Wed, 13 Feb 2013 05:48:30 +0000

The mirror, Phil, the mirror.

Pray more.

By: Old Joe

Old Joe — Wed, 13 Feb 2013 04:07:15 +0000

Phil,

By: Phil Veerkamp

Phil Veerkamp — Tue, 12 Feb 2013 02:16:30 +0000

Divino, you prompt me to look within. In so doing I suspect that my “energy” on this topic is rooted in “schadenfreude”. I find pleasure in your pain. It was incredibly painful for me when I moved from the family farm to my present ¼ acre with neighbors north, south, east and west. Things change, Divino. Enjoy!

By: Divino

Divino — Tue, 12 Feb 2013 00:59:30 +0000

Phil, you say “open space”. Tilden Park is zoned for Residential 1 Acre parcels. People buying property around that area would expect the property to be developed as designated. San Stino development would take agricultural land and residential 5 acre zones to high and medium density zones. There is nothing wrong with developing those sites as designated by the General Plan. Please get off your high-horse, “I’ve lived here longer than you, so I ‘m better than you” attitude. The fact is the BOS are allowing developers to change the zoning use of land to whatever they want. I want them to follow the law like I and others around me have. I didn’t change the use of the current Kniesel Collision Center from a sports center to an auto body center by using “Special Use” permits. The BOS did. I’m not even asking the BOS to change the General Plan. I’m asking for the General Plan to be applied to all, including the developers. AND, the way you keep defending the developers, it sounds as if you have something at stake, more than just belittling “NIMBYs”. Are you planning to cash in on your property soon? Anyone living near Phil Veerkamp might want to take notice. NI”PhilVeerkamps”BY.

By: Phil Veerkamp

Phil Veerkamp — Tue, 12 Feb 2013 00:40:48 +0000

Divino, you say, "People that live around Tilden Park want to put a stop to it because it affects them." I'm curious. Where are the people in EDC who would NOT feel affected by the development of an "open space" next to them? And what does an open space suitable for "responsible development" look like anyway? Where are there no "NIMBYS"?

By: Divino

Divino — Mon, 11 Feb 2013 23:51:58 +0000

To all,

Let’s get to the real issue brought forth by Teri Speel. It appears that Teri is not asking to stop development in Shingle Springs. She is asking for RESPONSIBLE development to take place. Her words in verbatim “Responsible growth requires a plan.” The question that needs to be asked is “What is responsible growth?”

Obviously, Teri is on the side of keeping the existing zoning as is. BOS are allowing developers to CHANGE the General Plan to meet their needs. Is this right? To meet the developers needs for San Stino is to ground down the hills around French Creek Road to allow for 1,000+ homes and streets to accommodate those homes. Does this seem right to you?

The Board of Supervisors are looking at the development for Tilden Park as a gateway to Coloma with a hotel for visitors to stay. Does that seem right to you? People that live around Tilden Park want to put a stop to it because it affects them. Also, there is not an outlet out of Wild Chaparral except back to Ponderosa Road. Remember the fire a few years back that blackened the hills between Shingle Springs and Cameron Park? The residents had one way out of that area. Now, developers want to put more bodies and structures in the same area?!? Scary stuff.

As to halting growth by closing the gate behind new residents, NO. I want new residents to have the same lifestyle that I have enjoyed. And, there is plenty of that without the reckless developers, with the help of the BOS, having their way.

By: Evelyn

Evelyn — Mon, 11 Feb 2013 13:47:12 +0000

THE GLOBAL WATER GRAB: MEET THE “NEW WATER BARONS” - HERE

By: Old Joe

Old Joe — Sun, 10 Feb 2013 06:43:04 +0000

Phil,

You attack people as hypocrites and you pray.

By: Evelyn

Evelyn — Sat, 09 Feb 2013 22:50:34 +0000

"The Apology-Gotcha Game" - HERE - (Seems written for conservatives, but I find it quite "non-denominational".)

By: Phil Veerkamp

Phil Veerkamp — Sat, 09 Feb 2013 20:23:24 +0000

Old Joe, I concede to your density. I have failed in my attempts to explain how I can simultaneously observe the hypocrisy of new arrivals to Eldorado County who, having found refuge from urban hell, raise their palm toward the borders and say, "HALT!" and at the same time convince you, Old Joe, that I possess no personal growth vision outside an overarching notion that growth will happen. Further it will happen, more than likely, near the existing utility and transportation infrastructure. You win, Old Joe. I do pray, however, that El Dorado County’s future density not exceed your own.

By: francescaduchamp@att.net

francescaduchamp@att.net — Sat, 09 Feb 2013 16:43:04 +0000

I thought Phil did give his view on “growth” PHIL: “Being a fourth generation EDC resident gives me no superior rights. But it does explain certain elements of my perspective on growth. I have witnessed the economy of this county mature from agrarian to the service/tech/bedroom/ omelet economy of today. I have witnessed the birth and evolution of land use planning and many of planning’s abuses as well as benefits. I have witnessed orchards, fields and open spaces give way to “you people”. The maturation of this county can be (and is) as nostalgically painful as the growing up of puppies, children, grandchildren and great-grandchildren. Things change. Communities grow. ” and here: ” ALL OF YOU have ruined “my” county. Raise the draw bridge? What hypocrisy!!!” And follow the water…as humans–you have to. Its one of our basic needs to survive. It has been fought over and coveted through human history more than any other treasure.

By: Old Joe

Old Joe — Sat, 09 Feb 2013 07:35:22 +0000

@Phil Veerkamp:

Phil,

On at least three occasions, you’ve labeled residents that have posted on this thread, desiring a rural lifestyle, as indulging in hypocrisy or as Hypocrites.

I find their honesty refreshing. Yet, when asked how you would like to see the county developed you hold your view as private. You are not so private in attacking people for their views or their wish to remain in a rural environment (such as it is).

Where does the borderline of hypocrisy lie? Is it with those that moved here for a rural lifestyle to escape a busy life?

Is it with those long time family rancher’s heirs that enjoyed the rural life growing up and now want to cash in on their ancestor’s hard work and make a mockery of their ancestor’s dreams?

Is it with those that care only about the almighty dollar, and don’t care about the urban sprawl the development will create as long as they financially capitalize on it? It’s an all about me attitude versus caring about the county and when developing property, being sensitive to what fits within the surrounding plots and housing

Indeed, I see a hypocrite.

By: Phil Veerkamp

Phil Veerkamp — Fri, 08 Feb 2013 06:50:41 +0000

Joe, my “private thoughts” will remain private.

By: Foamie Mouth®

Foamie Mouth® — Fri, 08 Feb 2013 06:19:13 +0000

Old Guy submit ure investergators lisenc to thecop shop. A privat thot is a privat thot. Wots ure own publik thot on the matter? Then, get a life, old guy. Must eye rephraze it 4 u?

By: Old Joe

Old Joe — Fri, 08 Feb 2013 05:30:02 +0000

@ Phil Veerkamp.

Following water doesn’t answer my question. My request is quite simple. I will rephrase, what is your “private thought” on the direction the county should take with regard to growth.

Thank you

By: Phil Veerkamp

Phil Veerkamp — Fri, 08 Feb 2013 04:28:12 +0000

LINK - SIMCITY - coming March 5th - Digital Deluxe Edition Includes Heroes and Villains Set, French City Set, German City Set, British City Set

By: Phil Veerkamp

Phil Veerkamp — Fri, 08 Feb 2013 04:15:29 +0000

Jim, are you wondering whether or not I play “Sim City” with El Dorado County and place homes, industries, roads, water lines, schools . . . . . . in varying configurations? No. I do not. The county will grow will change will break hearts will make money. It will probably be messy. Such is life. Deal with it.

By: Phil Veerkamp

Phil Veerkamp — Fri, 08 Feb 2013 04:05:17 +0000

Old Joe, my Great-grandfather, Francis, landed here in 1852. A friend of mine who was working toward his civil engineering license back around 1975 made a project out of researching my family’s original property transactions. Jim discovered that Francis’ first recorded property transaction was not for land. Great-grandpa’s first recorded property transaction was for a ¼ interest in the 32nd share of the Prairie Water Company. My “vision”, Old Joe, is borrowed from Great-grandpa Francis Veerkamp. Follow the water. There you will vision the growth of El Dorado County.

By: Old Joe

Old Joe — Fri, 08 Feb 2013 03:30:16 +0000

@Phil Veerkamp.

Phil: Thank you for the education on the requirements for the distribution of water.

My question was and is(given you are a long time resident)what are your thoughts about growth (what is now called “vision”) in El Dorado County.

Thank you

By: Dee

Dee — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 22:33:26 +0000

Phil is correct that population is growth is here to stay. I would like to see more conversation regarding in-fill projects and pedestrian pockets. Love in-fill projects but pedestrian pockets have been used to build high profit residential but tend to wind down and the commercial never becomes a reality. One reason is because those residential residents don’t want their life style downgraded. Sign, we live in interesting times.

By: Paddy O'furniture

Paddy O'furniture — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 22:29:01 +0000

My pleasure Dee. ;^)

By: Dee

Dee — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 22:04:49 +0000

Paddy, thank you for the laughs.

By: Phil Veerkamp

Phil Veerkamp — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 17:47:12 +0000

Thank you, Paddy. Much is explained. You strengthen my argument that longer (historical perspective) is better than shorter. Size matters. Sorry, James. John, huge respect!

By: James E.

James E. — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 17:26:39 +0000

DB, the hofer is what it is. An operation to lengthen a hofer would be quite painful.

By: DB Smith

DB Smith — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 16:24:17 +0000

Paddy, Good Mornin and what a FUN letter! Colonel, did you ever get your hofer lengthened?

By: Paddy O'furniture

Paddy O'furniture — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 16:19:16 +0000

O’furniture hearkens back to the olden day in the land of Eire, when me pappy was a notable woodworker. He, like Dee, Cookie, and Beyonce, was known only as Paddy (I’m named after him, don’t you know). Then, another Paddy moved into the village. Me pap didn’t like being called “old Paddy”, so folks distinguished them by calling pap “Paddy o’ the furniture”. Similarly, throughout all of time, the surnames of many people were their occupations. Think “Smith”, “Baker”, “Sadler” and even “Longhofer”. Yes, regarding that last one, back in the days of ancient Germania, if a man had a very short hofer, there were persons who were skilled in the art of lengthening them. The process was, however, not without risks and even a bit of pain. On occasion, those of fainter spirit would during the process, emit a mighty groan. There were called “Groaners” or just “Groans”. It was one of these who, when landing at Ellis Island years later, did seize upon the opportunity to shed this terrible surname and rearranged a couple of letters, therefore going from Groan to Garon. And now you know………….. The Rest of the Story. Paddy O’furniture. Good day?

By: Paddy O'furniture

Paddy O'furniture — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 16:18:23 +0000

James, I think the reason Cookie and Dee don’t use their last names is simply because they don’t need to. Once in a great while, someone so outstanding in their field comes along who doesn’t use a surname, i.e., Madonna, Beyonce, etc. “Dee” and “Cookie” are destined to become legends of conservative commentary. As for O’furniture…

By: Evelyn

Evelyn — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 15:56:56 +0000

Thank you, Bill. That “paying the bills” thing is a HUGE biggie.

By: Bill E.

Bill E. — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 15:39:52 +0000

As per the norm, the flow of mis-information cast by the naysayers is wildly off base. To look at today without looking back 40 years is a huge mistake. Historically farmers have sold off pieces of their land to pay bills to keep farming. Passing down the family business and property is also a problem as the pie keeps getting smaller, no one wants to farm and at some point it is no longer a viable ag parcel. The property sold is closest to the road because it is easiest to develop so now 1 to 20 acre parcels ring the property. Some of those buyers do property 3 way property splits. This happens multiple times over decades. The family grows up and no one wants that old lifestyle. Property close to the freeway has development value and the family cashes in. Leapfrog development along with the seemingly benign parcel splits are the root causes to the development push. Holiday lake area was part of a ranch, South Shingle area was multiple ranches, French Creek is in transition as described above. Some rancher sold the property that the local naysayers now live in and it is getting crowded on top of the hill of moral high ground. Cuzin Phil has got it right so it always impressive when pioneer families are able to hold on to their historical ranches.

By: Evelyn

Evelyn — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 15:35:45 +0000

There’s a nasty rumor that I’m the sister.

By: Phil Veerkamp

Phil Veerkamp — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 15:29:14 +0000

Paddy, my sister and I saw THE DAY THE EARTH STOOD STILL at the Empire

By: Phil Veerkamp

Phil Veerkamp — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 15:26:55 +0000

Old Joe, follow the water. - Parker’s Marble Valley - The water to supply this project will be the MOST EXPENSIVE water produced and delivered by EID. The required water CANNOT be delivered by gravity from the eastern plants. Those transmission lines are already running over capacity in the summertime. The required water will have to be pumped ($$$) up to EDH treatment plant (~ 300 vertical ft.) From there it will have to be pumped ($$$) to Oak Ridge – (~170 vertical ft.). From there it will have to be pumped ($$$) to Bass Lake Tanks –(~540 vertical ft.) (Folsom Lake to BLT approximately 1010 vertical feet). The pumping and transmission infrastructure from Oak Ridge to BLT needs to be built. The transmission infrastructure to Parker/Gallo development needs to be built. Do the math. $50,000,000 from the developers might be a starting point. - French Creek Road and Old French Town Road project - This project is the most “water friendly”. That is to say, it is the least impactful on EID’s production/transmission costs. - Diamond-Dorado center - Substantial upgrades and modifications to EID's existing distribution system will be required. Approximately 2,400 ft of 6" pipe along Hwy 49 will need to be upsized. A pressure reducing station (PRS) near the top of Sacramento hill will need to be repositioned to allow it to properly work in conjunction with the Diamond Springs Main (DSM). These vexing problems were under consideration while I was EID's Sr. Distribution Operator. The solutions are complicated and expensive. The existing PRS near Placerville is too high on the hill and needs to be relocated approximately 25’-30’ lower on the hydraulic grade to allow its discharge strategy to be coordinated with the DSM’s requirements. The developers need to pay.

By: Paddy O'furniture

Paddy O'furniture — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 15:07:54 +0000

Don’t remember a horse on the back of the drive-in screen. We only went there a few times, we caught most of our movies at the Empire. Saw Smokey and the Bandit and the Blues Brothers there.

By: Phil Veerkamp

Phil Veerkamp — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 15:02:48 +0000

James speculates, “Evelyn is a Veerkamp?” I have to ask, Colonel, how could the Good Ol’ Boy network possibly survive. If your speculation over this “Evelyn Veerkamp” thing connects with reality then she is a Good Ol’ Boy? . . . . . . or perhaps random distribution applies to Veerkamps just as it does to races, ethnicities, religions, sexes and planet of origin.

By: cookie65

cookie65 — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 14:22:23 +0000

Cheryl, you are missing my point. NONE of it would have happened in the first place had the government not intruded itself into the mortgage business and insisted lenders were not offering loans to low income and unqualified borrowers. From there it created a domino effect. http://www.boston.com/bostonglobe/editorial_opinion/oped/articles/2008/09/28/franks_fingerprints_are_all_over_the_financial_fiasco/

By: cookie65

cookie65 — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 14:14:00 +0000

Beno’s for Levi’s and the playground at the drive-in. Wasn’t their a cowboy on a horse on the back of the drive-in movie screen?

By: Old Joe

Old Joe — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 08:34:48 +0000

@ Phil Veerkamp:

What is your vision for El Dorado County? If you don’t mind listing in ten bullet-ed statements.
Thank you.

By: James E.

James E. — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 07:21:53 +0000

Evelyn is a Veerkamp? Now, if we can get the last names for Dee and Cookie, we can all be one happy family. Yes, I think that Paddy’s last name is really O’furniture. You would think it isn’t, therefore it must be.

By: Melanie

Melanie — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 04:46:18 +0000

Phil Veerkamp, I don’t often agree with what you say, but today, right on. Well spoken.

By: Melanie

Melanie — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 04:43:47 +0000

resident, surely you know that the county planners have NO say in what the Board of Supervisors (BOS) approves? They are worker bees, told to write environmental Negative Declarations for every single project. This county is planned by the developers with the blessings of the BOS. Habitat and natural spaces? The county has spent more than one million dollars in the past six years on habitat plans. The oak woodland plan was originally based on science and economics, and the developers whined and had it diluted by the BOS; the county got sued, and lost the lawsuit. Money down the drain. The Integrated Natural Resource Management Plan, or INRMP, has had no consultation with regulatory agencies CDFW (formerly DFG) and USFWS; therefore, it has no teeth, no mitigation certainty. It could have been a plan that worked on rare plants. Again, it is because the developers interfered, and the BOS went along with it. In the paper right now is an article about EDAC (Economic Development Advisory Committee) and it talks about the tireless commitment of “volunteers” on the committee. I say, BS. It mentions Art Marinaccio, developer consultant, and Jim Brunello, developer. It doesn’t mention Kathye Russell and Cindy Schaefer, but they are in the development community as well. THEY are planning the county. Your newly elected El Dorado High School board trustees were elected because El Dorado Hills developers spent big $$$ on their campaigns, to ensure that school district lines get changed, so that their development gets to go to Oakridge High School, not Ponderosa (not rich and upscale enough for them, they charge more $$$ for Oakridge HS homes). Money talks, many of the electeds are bought and paid for (not all, though).

By: Evelyn

Evelyn — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 04:31:25 +0000

JOKE: You may be relieved to hear that THE Veerkamps are virtually a myth. Possibly you may know the majority of your relatives, but I don’t know most of mine. Probably most of THE Veerkamps would say the same. On my sacred honor I swear to you I have never participated in, known of, or even have been invited to a business meeting of THE Veerkamps. The reason is simple. Our lives are separate. We are not a singularity. There is no mafia head or chieftain. Not even a Newsletter! But I’ll share with you a personal story. Five or six years ago I took my car to the garage for something or other. Upon identifying myself as the owner of said vehicle another customer snorted to the air in general and anyone who was breathing it, “Who do THE Veerkamps think they are?” Having not polled THE Veerkamps, I was unable to assuage his ire. I’m still not. About all I can say is that we – one at a time — were born here, some of us remained, we all (I think) love El Dorado County, and there are many people I know much better than my genetic family.

By: Evelyn

Evelyn — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 04:30:40 +0000

I see a Veerkamp beat me to it. So, I shall create a degree of separation …………….. ……………………………………

By: Phil Veerkamp

Phil Veerkamp — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 03:52:34 +0000

Joke’s on you asks, “Whose fault is it, Mr. V?” – - – It? Fault? I am puzzled. If “it” is growth, change, shifting political goals/factions/agendas, demographics then there is no “joke”. There is no fault to assign. I certainly have not been attempting to assign blame/fault for the processes at work. To all the new residents of El Dorado County I say, “Welcome”. Please reciprocate. Roll out the welcome mat for those behind you who seek what you have found. Or convince me that your arrival carries with it a right to exclude. My use of the word “hypocrite” is directed to those who arrive and then propose to exclude.

By: Joke's on you

Joke's on you — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 01:39:25 +0000

1. Long established locals (like Veerkamps) get politically powerful, approve lots of new developments. 2. They sell off big chunks of their land and cash in big time. 3. People from urban areas come here for better lifestyle. 4. Locals keep selling land, more developments, more people from urban areas. 5. Recent transplants grow in numbers, become politically influential. 6. locals decry the transplants, tell the newcomers not to change “our ways”. 7. With the population shift, soon Liberals will take over local politics. 8. Whose fault is it, Mr. V?

By: Paddy O'furniture

Paddy O'furniture — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 01:00:59 +0000

Cookie, I do remember Sambo’s. Had breakfast there quite a few times. Right before going across the street to Beno’s to get a new pair of Levi’s, and then up the walk to Hangtown Pharmacy (that was at the upper end of the shopping center, right?). Those were the days. Trying to remember if there was anything at all on Missouri Flat road then…I think Placerville was mostly on Broadway an Main Streets and the newer stuff on P’ville drive. My dad used to go to the Westener, a little bar and grill, which I think is now Durango’s. Remember that one?

By: chrispytahoe

chrispytahoe — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 00:45:44 +0000

I moved to Placerville in 1991 at the age of 19.I have not been in El Dorado as long as some of you, but long enough to see big changes, even since 91. I have some additional perspective for what is happening. I grew up in an area of New England that WAS and IS semi rural. You see, in that part of the world these areas are built out. The majority of semi rural areas were build around wagon roads and town commons dating back to the early 1600s. So everyone in my home town has at least an acre. You do not see track homes or fences. California development is a huge scam. Tons of land, but they cram everyone together in ‘desirable locations’ and trick people into thinking they are getting in on something. That’s just sad.

By: Cheryl

Cheryl — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 00:41:14 +0000

Cookie, the banks were able to make a lot of money off of the foreclosures, just google “how the banks profited off foreclosures”, it is really sickening how the taxpayers, once again, got screwed.
And to Shingle Senior, yes, the comments always get off track, it’s called conversation. And Cookie, I remember Sambo’s, they had to change the name because it wasn’t PC, must have been those darn liberals again, LOL

By: "Accept It"

"Accept It" — Thu, 07 Feb 2013 00:35:50 +0000

Shingle Senior brings us back to reality. The GOB network is a major screw up. “Accept it.”

By: Shingle Senior

Shingle Senior — Wed, 06 Feb 2013 23:24:01 +0000

Thank you Teri for your letter. Your point is taken and most of these posters have gotten way off point.

The BOS and power of this county have and continue to hand this county to the developers and special interests with no questions asked.

In Shingle Sprins they allowed Nissan to put in a car dealership with outside loud speakers….illegal under our county laws. The county allowed a car repair business to build in an established neighborhood and spew toxic chemicals in our neighborhood….illegal. The county allows business to build and then set condition they must meet and these conditions are never enforced…..illegal.

I have lived here over 30 years and I am 3rd generation. If a home owner tried some of the stuff that the county allows businesses to do I would have been in jail a long time ago.

The developer of Tilden Park is trying to build it in a field with three underground springs and it is the drainage for our entire neighborhood (over 140) homes…..county says let ‘em build. The State Dept. of Transportation says that this development is illegal because there is no upgrade to the intersection at Ponderosa Road and Hwy 50….the county says let ‘em build. San Stino is no better and the problems with this development are massive…..the county says let ‘em build.

It is clear to anyone with a 2nd grade education what is going on in our county and it is time for people to get informed and fight for the right to keep our county rural.